Curse

Napalm Flame · Jan 05, 2008, 02:41 AM // 02:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barkeep

Well, dual e-surge echo etc. mesmers in TA.. lol.. lets not talk about that.

But I did think about debilitating shot spam on the war instead of on the monks.. -8 every 10 seconds on 2 energy regen is how much exactly? Has anyone tried this?

spike is 10/15 energy for the war, 20 if he wants to get out as well.

That's true, that's a possibility too, though I saw a team running dual ESurge while we were running knightway. Screwed us over pretty harshly with some E-denial, rendered our spiking capabilities to be pretty much useless. Also, they had interrupts for the warrior. It almost seemed like they had made the build just to counter us.

And as for 3 ESurge spikers... That's just lol.

And in other words, yes, the note about echo ESurge was intended as a joke. =D

yum · Jan 05, 2008, 07:05 AM // 07:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by ibreaktoilets

Dshot>monk spike.

400 + ping and 4 fps > dshot

Aera · Jan 05, 2008, 11:53 AM // 11:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by yum

400 + ping and 4 fps > dshot

Proper connection and PC > that

...this is going nowhere.

RhanoctJocosa · Jan 05, 2008, 04:20 PM // 16:20

We came up against this earlier today. We were running Eviscerate, Cripshot, ESurge and Woh. They were able to get a spike off on our monk right at the beginning because the ranger couldn't interrupt anything because of LoS. After that, though, we just kept prots up, interrupted stuff on the spike and killed one monk at a time. I'd agree with calling it griefing, but what can you do? ><

Seraphim of Chaos · Jan 05, 2008, 04:29 PM // 16:29

Offmonk aura of stab just owns everything right now in TA. Whether it be Thumpergay, Gayway, or this. I just suggest running aura of stab on your mesmer or ranger (if you're not running either one, you fail).

Aera · Jan 05, 2008, 06:40 PM // 18:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seraphim of Chaos

Offmonk aura of stab just owns everything right now in TA. Whether it be Thumpergay, Gayway, or this. I just suggest running aura of stab on your mesmer or ranger (if you're not running either one, you fail).

We never run Aura of Stability, yet never lose. If you need it, then you fail.

C wut I did thar?

Anyways, it can be very handy, but I'm not running it if we don't need it. Can't be bothered to spec attributes into prot for it, or put it on my skillbar to begin with.

Seraphim of Chaos · Jan 05, 2008, 08:34 PM // 20:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aera

We never run Aura of Stability, yet never lose. If you need it, then you fail.

C wut I did thar?

Anyways, it can be very handy, but I'm not running it if we don't need it. Can't be bothered to spec attributes into prot for it, or put it on my skillbar to begin with.

Our mesmer or ranger always has the room for Aura of Stab. TA builds are so reliant on KD, it is a very very very handy skill. One can spec into 6 prot to maintain aura of stab almost infinitely.

moko · Jan 05, 2008, 08:42 PM // 20:42

i would agree, but it's a hex meta, cause people don't know how to survive currently.

i don't care if i get kd'd once more cause of bulls because our ranger has purge over aura of stab if we win the game 20 secs later.

damocles · Jan 05, 2008, 09:22 PM // 21:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by RhanoctJocosa

They were able to get a spike off on our monk right at the beginning because the ranger couldn't interrupt anything because of LoS.

Was your ranger trying to hide or something? Or was your monk on a ledge? If it's neither of these I don't get how your ranger fails to interrupt because of LoS.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aera

We never run Aura of Stability, yet never lose. If you need it, then you fail.

What Seraphim is trying to say that you fail if you don't run a mesmer or a ranger.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seraphim of Chaos

Our mesmer or ranger always has the room for Aura of Stab. TA builds are so reliant on KD, it is a very very very handy skill. One can spec into 6 prot to maintain aura of stab almost infinitely.

It is a very good skill versus shove spike, but I think you could have a more useful skill on your bar instead since you're facing different teams. I'm not taking aura of stability just to counter one gimmick build. Purge Signet would do a much better job versus other teams you face in TA (for example: hexes, which are more common).

You might say that aura of stability is nice versus other teams as well, but I tend to disagree. If you have a decent team who knows how to kite bulls strikes and know how to avoid other melee attacks that knock you down, then there's no need for aura of stability. If for some reason your monk does get kd'd there's always the emergency button in the form of a blocking stance.

Seraphim of Chaos · Jan 05, 2008, 10:50 PM // 22:50

Purge Signet is a very strong choice, that is why our mesmer runs both.

RhanoctJocosa · Jan 06, 2008, 04:48 PM // 16:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by damocles

Was your ranger trying to hide or something? Or was your monk on a ledge? If it's neither of these I don't get how your ranger fails to interrupt because of LoS.

He was minimised for a second and so was a little bit behind the party; as we turned a corner they got a spike off. He couldn't interrupt anything because he was not yet past the corner, if you can imagine that.

Anyway, while this build is pretty easy to beat with a proper TA team, it's still a fkn joke against RA teams. I was in a really, really good RA team today but we simply couldn't do anything about the spike (we had no healer). So QQ/tantrum/etc. I have no idea what ANet can do about this.

LuckyGiant · Jan 07, 2008, 12:23 AM // 00:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by RhanoctJocosa

I have no idea what ANet can do about this.

Packeting the smite dmg seems like the best option, which will allow monks a fair chance to stop it. Still got the problem of cactching them and killing them after they port away and dash though.

2 things that absolutely decimated it we found when messing around were (but uncommon skills in TA):
Spike trap/barbed trap
Grasping was kuurong

Schroedinger · Jan 07, 2008, 05:22 PM // 17:22

I'm adding damage here.

116 per monk = 348
100ish on the War = 100
+Deep Wound = Reduce total health 20%.

So you can't kill anything with more than 448 X 1.25 = 560 Health without prolonging the spike? I haven't faced this yet, but I'm thinking that doesn't scare me. Where does the rest of the damage come from? And, why does it matter, since anything past the first two skills is going to come after Zealous Benediction or Word of Healing goes off on the target?

Shielding Hands is 1/4ths cast and would knock about 20% of the spike damage off (Effectively negating Deep Wound).

the_deSKtructor · Jan 07, 2008, 05:38 PM // 17:38

Monks use both stonesoul and holy strike. Those 2 skills on 3 monks deal 660ish dmg. Shove at 14 tactics deals 71 dmg, the deep wound is about 100ish dmg and crushing deals 80 dmg or so too.

So the spike is 900ish dmg, that is more than enough to kill someone (especially if that someone is a knocked down monk)

Schroedinger · Jan 07, 2008, 06:33 PM // 18:33

The skills say 58 dmg + 58 conditional at 15 ability; how does it get to 660?

Tab · Jan 07, 2008, 06:36 PM // 18:36

Two from each monk, 3 monks. 116*6=696.

the_deSKtructor · Jan 07, 2008, 06:41 PM // 18:41

tho they run 14 instead of 15 so the dmg is 55 + 55

Barkeep · Jan 08, 2008, 12:36 PM // 12:36

Guys.. no need to discuss if the spike works. It does. The 3 monks alone deal 660 dmg. Enough to kill anything.

Aura of stab is a nice option for teams that are having problems with this. If it was as easy to beat this as some people make it sound then nobody would have made this thread and nobody would have replied.

I played against a decent monk spike y-day. It seemed debilitating shot on the war worked nicely. Not good enough to prevent the spike completely, but the warrior didnt have enough energy to teleport anymore, so he had to walk up to the target to shove, making it easier to keep the pressure on.

Out of the 3 monks we normally choose the RC as our main target, he seems to be most vonourable. (sp?)

Schroedinger · Jan 08, 2008, 08:10 PM // 20:10

Assuming you have a balance setup of Mo/X, R/Mo, W/E, and X/X (Caster):

1. Off monk Aura.
2. Interrupt Shove and preprot the monk with something cheap (Drops spike damage to 650-700; presumably the monk has -almost- that much health). Of course, without shove the monk may be able to catch.
3. KD anyone on the spike. They need 4 to kill.
4. E Denial on the war.
5. Someone fill me in on why Balanced Stance doesn't work?
6. Constantly renewed crip/KD on the warrior to keep him out of the monk's bubble. (Obviously difficult).

tinygod · Jan 11, 2008, 10:11 PM // 22:11

I play ranger alot In RA and TA. In TA if you see 3 monks and 1 warrior. you know right away just by the team make up what the build is. My ranger always carries an off monk spike support skill. some times KD Protection, some times throwdirt, other times a simple interupt can stop a spike, if you know the timing. But the key is to have a ranger.

Rangers HAVE to be the best class for running any secondary without being in effective Seconded by warriors. But most other class's are much more effective as hybrids. Rangers and warriors almost always have atleast 1 spare skill square they can give up if needs be. alot of builds especially DS (dragon slash) and BHA (broadhead arrow) can function at 90% with just 4 skills. everthing else is just making them 10% better. So in short.

1 good monk.
2 others ( build dependant)
1 ranger ( carry off monk anti spike to protect the monk from KD or Spread blind)

usually will get you 10 wins.

Note* I know You seldom see it, but I love to run Throw Dirt on my BHA ranger. A STAPLE IMO of that bar. nothing like shuting down a caster and than shuting down 1 or 2 mele as they try and get past you for a spike. The mele find them selves blind with no heals and no removals coming. And now they are ass deep into enemy territory.